Nintendo 3DS announced (next "real" handheld, not DS rev)

[Caydr]

Dunno why they're announcing it at this point, but whatever.

Confirmed/Facts:
- It has at least one 3D display.

- The 3D technology does not use glasses, but some other method that apparently only works on smaller screens. It has been used on cellphones successfully.

- It features some sort of "3D input control", I'm guessing something akin to a very simple "SpaceNavigator" 3D mouse, probably lacking the twist and "up" axis, but able to be pushed "down".

- It will be backwards-compatible with DS and DSi-enhanced cartridges, and DSiWare.

- It will be unveiled at this year's E3.

- Its diagonal size is smaller than that of the DSi XL/LL.

- It will launch "in Nintendo's fiscal 2011"... so... worst case scenario, sometime in 2012?

- Built-in rumble and (second-generation?) accelerometer.


Unconfirmed/Probable:
- Because it is backwards-compatible, it will have at least one touchscreen, d-pad, two shoulder buttons, four face buttons, start/select, and two cameras. If they're going to cut anything, it'll be the cameras... but I think they'll keep them.

- Backwards-compatibility doesn't mean the screens will be the same size or pixel resolution. For example, the old screens are 256x192, so for the new screens they could just bump the resolution up to 512x384 and double each pixel. Or they could do something more elegant and actually anti-alias or use HQ2X or something.

- Because it has a camera facing the player, games could very easily implement head tracking. There's already at least one DSi game that does this, but Nintendo could make this easier/better for developers.


Popular Speculation:
- 3D probably won't be a mandated game feature, just as touchscreen input wasn't always used on DS games. It'll probably be something you can turn off, to quell the rioting from people who get headaches from certain 3D technologies.

- Better cameras? Or at least a nicer one on the front?

- Better speakers?

- Probably some media playback functionality.

- Almost certainly going to use an Nvidia Tegra/Tegra 2 chip, which I'm terrified will increase game production costs as a result of much higher standards for what a triple-A title can look like (versus DS)


Wild Speculation:
- Nintendo might break their long tradition of keeping mobile gaming platforms under $200 at launch, or else break their equally-long tradition of making a profit on hardware at launch?

- SDXC support?

- OLED? Hopefully that newfangled kind that isn't supposedly useless in sunlight?

- Wifi wrapper so "old DS" games aren't reliant on WEP encryption?


Hilarious Caydr Fantasy:
- Because OLEDs are way, way thinner than LCDs (assuming they use OLEDs at all), they put a THIRD screen on TOP of the lid, making it look something like an iPhone or other modern smartphone, and you can watch movies and play downloadable games on it.

- And it's also a phone - a with optional live video, at that. And a GPS! So I can go anywhere with only one device needing to be in my pocket rather than having to wear cargo pants everywhere. It would be ubiquitous overnight.

- Virtual console functionality, since the Tegra chips are already more powerful than what's in the Wii?

- Metroid Dread as a launch title?

[CarRepairer]

some other method that apparently only works on smaller screens.

It works on any sized screen.

[Caydr]

Not this particular technology, no. From what I've heard anyway.

[SinbadEV]

My guess is that they are going to put a Lenticular Lens Layer on one of the screens... then if they double-up the pixels on old games to bridge both "ridges" (part of Caydr's speculation) then each eye will see the same image, while allowing them to use the full, doubled resolution for the 3D part,

edit: this method only really works well on small displays too... and is cheap.

[Caydr]

Oh god I hope not, those things always look so cheesy! This is the source for the display being 3D:

http://translate.google.com/translate?j ... l=ja&tl=en

It seems to display different images depending on where you look at the picture from, but it is limited to small displays because you need to be directly in front of them for the effect to work. Up/down tilting shouldn't affect the 3D, but being off to the left or right too much would cause your eyes to both see the same image.

If you tried to use that on a large TV, only one person could watch it, so that's the limiting factor.

I think the average distance between human eyes is something like 8-12 cm... my pupilary distance is 9.5 cm IIRC... or was it 8.5... Well whatever. So divide that by half and it means you'd have about 4 centimeters or so of wiggle room either to the left or right before you'd lose the effect. That's about 1.75 inches.

I'm not sure if that's good or bad. Suppose you were on a bus or something and there were bumps. In that situation, you'd bounce up and down, not disrupting the effect at all. If you were sitting sideways and the bus suddenly slowed down or accelerated, you'd tilt one direction or the other a bit, but your whole body would tilt including your arms and head, so again the effect wouldn't be lost.

I'm not an expert at all and this is just speculation, I just found out about all this a matter of minutes ago. Even if the technology functions exactly as I said above and you only have about a couple inches of wiggle room for your head to go back and forth, I think it would still work quite well. Time will tell...

[SinbadEV]

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/01/hitachi-shows-3/

(doesn't really explain it at all better... my guess is it's just a really really fancy lenticular effect)

[Caydr]

Related:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/23/nint ... -to-the-d/

http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/23/nint ... n-and-sha/


Also I'm realizing now that my earlier hypothesis about how the 3D thing could work would prevent further development of those fairly popular "book-style" games where you hold the DS on its side... This format works pretty well for some genres, so Nintendo would probably hesitate to kill it. I guess I'm completely in the dark.

Here's hoping it works well and isn't followed up by a "motion plus" version that does what the original was supposed to.

[CarRepairer]

It seems to display different images depending on where you look at the picture from, but it is limited to small displays because you need to be directly in front of them for the effect to work.

Is 56 inches a small display?
http://gizmodo.com/5057832/philips-3d-a ... n-the-eyes

[SinbadEV]

[Caydr]

@carrepairer

O HAI THER, YES, THERE'S SUCH A THING AS GLASSES-LESS BIG-SCREEN 3D, BUT WE'RE NOT NECESSARILY TALKING ABOUT THE SAME TECHNOLOGY OR IMPLEMENTATION.

This PARTICULAR ONE reportedly is not suitable for large TVs due to the aforementioned limitation of the effect only working on a narrow angle directly ahead. The wider the screen, the smaller the effective viewing area and the greater the complexity of the system to make the effect work at all.

Douche.

@sinbad

That's a possibility but if I understand the diagram, you would probably have kind of a jarring shifting effect every time you moved your head from one set of lenses to another. And also... again if I'm seeing this right, it seems to rely on your head being a pretty specific distance from the screen, doesn't it?

I'm not an expert on this at all, haven't even seen a 3D tv yet, glasses-required or otherwise, but a lenticular system like that just seems rather complex and difficult to implement well. Not to mention expensive! Not the kind of thing I'd expect to see from Nintendo, they're all about cheaply implementing existing technology in creative ways, especially lately. And they have a hard-won reputation for reliability and quality.

The Sharp parallax barrier thing seems to be sort of like a lenticular lens system, except it only creates two images, and what you see depends on what side of the screen you're looking at it from. So... like a lenticular lens system but much simpler due to it being intentionally designed to only work for one person.

[Neddie]

They're retiring the GBA cartridge size, correct? I'm still clinging to the original GBA, nothing since has had an acceptable ergonomic design and the traditional physical quality I expect from Nintendo hardware.

I've been looking to the next two generations of Nintendo handhelds as the escape strategy for a small project I'm involved in, for which I am presently designing seven titles. Thus I have high hopes for the 3DS.

I'm not certain I would like to have Rumble in it and I am not fond of 3D displays, but trust me, I am otherwise as interested as you, Caydr. They are more likely to double the screen resolutions than to implement anti-aliasing for emulation - anti-aliasing on sprites and other pixel-quality artwork leeches detail which is key to the format.

I'm guessing it will launch at 159.99 or 179.99 USD. At that price I expect them to skimp comparatively on both the speakers and the cameras. They might try to simulate the d-pad on the 3D input device, but I fervently hope otherwise. A few weeks ago I heard something about them putting something like the C stick from the Gamecube controller on their coming handheld - that might be the 3D input.

[SinbadEV]

http://www.walyou.com/blog/2010/04/06/i ... -handheld/




Probably more rumors, but if this is real... OMG OMG SQUEE!!!!

[Wartender]

http://www.walyou.com/blog/2010/04/06/i ... -handheld/




Probably more rumors, but if this is real... OMG OMG SQUEE!!!!

i'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that looks like a 3D model, because of strange lights, strange wood (texture), and perfect rectangularness of the comic books.

EDIT: also this

[AF]

The video i saw suggests its the parallax viewing tech combined with a better middle camera, you know fromt hat guy who had the TV and that targets and the wiimote?

[SinbadEV]

[...]

i'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that looks like a 3D model, because of strange lights, strange wood (texture), and perfect rectangularness of the comic books.

EDIT: also this

You have made me sad... alas those look like renders to me too now... but it would be awesome if they DID do it that way.

[AF]

Who in there right mind would release a product like that? Its HUGE, just imagine holding the controls in your hand while the big screen tilts it over and you have to apply extra pressure because the centre of gravity is a foot infront of you..

[momfreeek]

If you were sitting sideways and the bus suddenly slowed down or accelerated, you'd tilt one direction or the other a bit, but your whole body would tilt including your arms and head, so again the effect wouldn't be lost.

Rolling around on a bus doesn't sound like the ideal usage scenario..

would work great with this though:

The video i saw suggests its the parallax viewing tech combined with a better middle camera, you know fromt hat guy who had the TV and that targets and the wiimote?

No special hardware.. just head tracking.

[AF]

Indeed, just track the eyes and adjust the view onscreen accordingly, and you have uber low tech cheap 3D view

[SinbadEV]

as far as the "awkward center of gravity" in the faked images... If they put enough weight in the control area (like a big battery or whatever) that would resolve that complaint.

[AF]

Which would make it not very 'portable' at all.

Then there are the practical problems, such as how do you walk around playing this in a school yard or on the way to work? Do you think the people on the bus will appreciate you taking up twice as much floorspace? Or when you turn and it bashes into a tonne of people?